cchan
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Power to Gotech System

Post by cchan »

Hello,

We have been able to start my Alfa that we converted to a 3.0L 24V. We are using the gotech pro and we basically hot wired it to start it. We put the red wire for the power for the gotech box to the Ljet old relay and we grounded out the black wire for the gotech box. We then had power to the box. It was alway on so when you turned off the ignition switch the engine stayed on until we pulled the red wire. We also put the fuel pump power line to the hot wire of the Ljet old relay to have power. We put another relay between the hot wires of both the fuel and gotech box just in case there was a short. As I stated before, the Alfa Started right up.

Now, we are puzzled what would be the best way to permanently hook this up so that the ignition switch will do this for us. Is there anyone else who has done this already. We have the manual but we are not good at electronics and need some suggestions. We are planning on having our Alfa Mechanic look at this but I would like to let him know what the forum suggests and well. The reason being is that he maybe unfamilar with the Gotech system and my 3.0L 24V engine. I am just guessing this though since he recommended that I not do this conversation.

Thanks again for any input that you may have.
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aggarcia
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Post by aggarcia »

I installed a Gotech in both a GTV6 and Milano. I did away with the combo relay and all the L-jet engine compartment harness. I used a standard bosch type relay with double pin 87 ( not a 87 and 87a). In the remaining connector from the combo relay, you will find the wire for fuel pump, and a switched voltage wire. Use the switched voltage wire to turn on and off your relay. I used main power for the relay straight from the junction box. hope this helps.
ANDREWG

1982 GTV6 ITS #63
1988 Milano Verde - Project car
1988 Milano Verde IMSA IS - now SCCA ITE
1991 164S

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cchan
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Post by cchan »

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for your post. Just to clarify my understanding of this. The Relay consists of two black boxes. There is a right box (Drivers side) and a left box(passager side) They are right next to each other. The relay mount is mounted to the left of the windshield wiper mechanism. We removed the right box and are only using the left one. This is looking at the boxes from the front of the Alfa. As a temporary set up we "Hot Wired" the system just to start it up to hear the engine using the left box only. I am assuming this is the pin 87 relay that you are referring too??

I was thinking of using the pink wire to for the power to the go tech. I have not spoken with Roger (Mechanic yet to get his opinion). Is this how you did this? Also, do you know what each wire represents on the left relay. I have a Manual but I do not know how to read this correctly. This is the Manual that is supose to be for the Milano GTV6. It looks like the wiring is for the milano though. Maybe if you have the same manual you can direct me to the page number. My understanding is there is a car disk and this Manual for Mechanics. I am just tying to understand this set up for my own eduction since I am very ignorant when it comes to electical stuff.
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Post by bteoh »

CChan,

How is your motor going? Have you managed to get your GoTech Pro tuned properly and how smooth did you manage to get it? My engine is similiar to yours but I can't seem to get it tuned to run as smooth as OEM. I still have idle problems and slight hesitation on initial throttle. I noticed your vacuum line is situated similiar to mine but it's still a distance away from the throttle body. My understanding is that the vacuum line for the MAP sensor should be as close to the throttle butterfly as possible for better throttle response. Just wondering what your experience is with your current setup. I also noticed that you had additional vacuum hoses running from the plenum, any idea what you are using those for?
The engine was tested and tuned in South Africa but being much higher than sea level in Johannesburg, it is proving very rich when running in Perth, which is almost at sea level. I presume the atmospheric levels in California should be quite similiar to Perth. Maybe we can share maps if you already have yours tuned properly.

Cheers, Brian
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Barry
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Post by Barry »

Brian,The Alfa engine likes a slightly rich mixture for idle..And don't be afraid of going al bars up and start the left low load part of the map from 1-333 rpm...Always remember that most cars idle around 2ms duty cycle.

Your idle bar should be around bar 10 to 12?? Make all 2ms from left to bar 12 and see what it does.
Obviously you will trim bars to the left down for cruising lean mixtures higher up in the rev range.
You still with me here? :D

Decrease your % throttle enrichment (left bottom of the f5 page) to about 3 to 4 %.If it smooths the transition on acceleration,the main maps are too rich.and vice versa..
The throttle percentage active should also be around 5 %.otherwise your running on enrichment all the time..
Get a good quality 4 wire lambda ..something like Innovate technologies..This piece of testing equipment will show up acceleration pump values .. :wink:
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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Post by Barry »

AND BACK UP YOUR OLD MAPS FIRST!!! 8)
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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Post by bteoh »

Thanks Barry,

With the throttle enrichment %, is it the "Accel DV/DT" row? It was set at 5 but I'll try 4 and see what happens. Start up fuel is at 42 - should I set it higher so that the engine doesn't die after cranking? I've set the bars before 12 to 2.03. Haven't tried it on the car but will do so soon.

BTW, something looked strange when I was changing the spark plugs - Cyl 3 had some calcific deposits around it and some on the spark plug body (Near the ceramic portion). Looks like some water / coolant was in the spark plug well but not in the cylinder (Coolant levels was a bit low and had to be topped up - no oil in the coolant observed)). Cyl 2 had lots of oil in the well - I presume the seal between the camshaft cover and spark plug well isn't sealing well.
Spark plug tips - 1 was burning well; 2 and 3 had black sooty carbon; 3 , 4 and 6 was wet and quite sooty as well. I have the Innovate LM-1 but the readings prior to pulling the plugs out were very inconsistent. At low revs it was reading between 15-18:1 and higher revs was somewhere between 12.5 and 13. Adjusted it close to 14.7 at idle/low revs but the plugs indicated too rich a mixture??? Could the sensor be faulty? Will try to take a pic of the plugs - I think I threw them out.

Appreciate your help :-)
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Barry
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Post by Barry »

Brian,What ign. setup are you running??
Wasted spark,3x double coils with plug leads??
Are these leads resistor leads??
What plugs you using??resistor or non resistor??
Im trying to get to the uneven burn colour on the plugs here..
What injectors you running??164 702`s?White top??I think so..

The LM-1 is the kit to have! I can set up accel.values with it.

If you can,run your car..Then remove the plugs and keep them in order of removal..take a pic and post please..It sounds like the same hassle I went through for FOUR months before finding the problem..

I notice you relate fuel mixtures to revs...wrong,relate them to LOAD.Be it low rev load ,medium or high revs load..Cruising afr-18

Your engine specs-30l 24v,164 bosch 702 injectors If I remember correctly..gta 1 cams..Can you confirm this?
I might have a map you can try...
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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Post by Mezevenf »

I'd be interested in that map too please Barry!

Though mine is using reground cams from Dawie, though I also have a set of GTA cams here that he sent me.
Bernard M (AKA Mef - Mezevenf)

1986 75QV 3.0L 24v V6 - Silver
1985 GTV6 2.5L 12v V6 - Red
1999 166 3.0L 24v V6 - Red

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Barry
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Post by Barry »

Mezevenf wrote:I'd be interested in that map too please Barry!

Though mine is using reground cams from Dawie, though I also have a set of GTA cams here that he sent me.
B,Yes,I remember the cams..Yours were also Gta 1..
The map is simply a very good "rough" map..It will allow you to drive and probably be able to floor flat foot full load..From this map you need to fine tune and adjust everything to your needs..

Ive seen maps posted here before..Is it done the same way as posting a pic? ie: an attachment??
This were Im dumb with computors...
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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Barry
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Post by Barry »

Here`s some free performance advice for you 24v guys...

Remove the "hot" exhaust cam and replace it with your stock standard factory exhaust cam...

Performance for free...!!

Look at my video`s for proof thereof...youtube-Xenithonman.. 8)
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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Mezevenf
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Post by Mezevenf »

Yea I think you can just attach them Barry :)

I'm pretty sure the exhaust cams on mine are standard, just the intake regrounded, though you seem to know more about my engine than I do, haha.
Bernard M (AKA Mef - Mezevenf)

1986 75QV 3.0L 24v V6 - Silver
1985 GTV6 2.5L 12v V6 - Red
1999 166 3.0L 24v V6 - Red

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Post by bteoh »

Barry,

My engine is identical to Bernard's. I think it had the Group 1 cams, VR6 coil packs, yellow top injectors? Not sure about plug leads but maybe you can gather from the pics.

Couldn't find the other plugs but here's a few pics of the Cyl no. 3 plugs. Doesn't look good at all. I have a new set of NGK platinum plugs but didn't want to put them on untill the engine is running better. Had a set of Nippon Denso K 20R-U but have now put a set of NGK BKR6EYA.

Any info is very much appreciated.

Pity Bernard and I are so far apart geographically - otherwise we could get Barry an airline ticket to Oz and help us tune the cars :-)
Attachments
Coil Pack.jpg
Coil Pack.jpg (75.31 KiB) Viewed 13697 times
injectors.jpg
injectors.jpg (57.47 KiB) Viewed 13699 times
Note the calcific deposits, how did that get in the plug well?
Note the calcific deposits, how did that get in the plug well?
Cyl 3 Plug.jpg (27.97 KiB) Viewed 13699 times
Cyl 3 Plug.2.jpg
Cyl 3 Plug.2.jpg (31.66 KiB) Viewed 13696 times
Cyl 3 Plug3.jpg
Cyl 3 Plug3.jpg (43.15 KiB) Viewed 13695 times
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Mezevenf
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Post by Mezevenf »

bteoh wrote:Pity Bernard and I are so far apart geographically - otherwise we could get Barry an airline ticket to Oz and help us tune the cars :-)
Hahaha :D
Bernard M (AKA Mef - Mezevenf)

1986 75QV 3.0L 24v V6 - Silver
1985 GTV6 2.5L 12v V6 - Red
1999 166 3.0L 24v V6 - Red

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Barry
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Post by Barry »

I should be there in a coupla months time..... 8) :D Were working on a trip down under..

Brian,that plug has oil...If you can remove the exhaust manifold and check for wet oil...bet you its covered..actually,wipe a finger in the tailpipe..rub fingers together and see if its all shiny and oily.. :cry:

A rich mixture will be sooty but DRY.!

Yellow top injectors are probably std. 2.5 24v ones..Part number??
French cars are shit and shit expensive to service and bloody awful and unreliable and expensive and friends don't let friends drive french cars and you wait years for parts.
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