ALFAGTV6.COM

Micke · Post by **Micke** » Wed May 11, 2005 1:26 am

I've been thinking about entering with an Alfa for some years already. Main obstacle was that I'm 1500 km from my garage and preparing a car was impossible. I actually already bought a 24V6 engine to fit my car.

Things will change as I'm moving back to Finland end of July and then I'll have time and capacity (but not the loot anymore)

I have pretty good ideas what is needed to achieve a results which would be acceptable to me (top 30 total).

Anyway, here's what you need to get the necessay attention....
As temperature was about +2 deg I can guess a couple of hangers stiff enough for some heavy tools

Jim K · Post by **Jim K** » Wed May 11, 2005 2:02 am

Thats it Mats, I like the spirit! Hey, I figured out, the team's legal address will be in the South Pole (for obvious reasons like court summons, lawsuits for all crimes committed by team members, foreclosures, collection agencies and such annoying trivia!).
We will definitely need a good lawyer (spelled liar?) who will will make a case out of nothing (as usual), sue the right people and we're set for life!
Team members will drive M3's as company cars, registered in Nepal where we will pay $3 yearly towards the Everest Expeditions Fund (plus another covert $5 to the local mayor/justice of the peace/undertaker) and receive (yearly) a $250,000 tax-deductible donation certificate. Each company car will be supplied with a box with 5 different sets of plates, misleading documents, a false beard/mustache just in case and one condom for the unlikely event all these measures fail (regrettably, your last line of defence!).
Cheerleaders and playmates will be approved by the manager personally, after a short (private) interview. Secretly taped interviews may be sold to bolster team income!
For legal reasons, team assets will be limited to one (old) bicycle, used brake pads and broken engine parts. Everything else will be registered to where no legal connection with the team can be traced.
Now, Mats and Micke will decide which race to enter and who will drive, until Nicki pays his fee to drive for us.
Thats it for now, any lawyers out there ready for big time??
Jim K.

Maurizio, Nobody will be driving on Saturday, so we'll have enough time to decide who's car to steal for the team and where to pepaint it!!

Maurizio · Post by **Maurizio** » Wed May 11, 2005 2:14 am

Hmmm Jim, looks like you know your way around in the "fake bussines world", how come ..... Ok will discuss offline saturday

Jim K · Post by **Jim K** » Wed May 11, 2005 2:37 am

Fake? FAKE???!! Maurizio, the whole world works like this, except us dumb engineers!!

Just take a look at expensive yacht marinas everywhere, see all the strange flag registrations they have? Those countries are called "tax paradise" and they pay next to nothing for their huge fortunes (except the measly bribe to the local mayor with 8 false teeth and 13 children!). I merely sarcastically exaggerate the world we live in, probably because I'm not clever enough to do like they do!! However, I insist on personally interviewing cheerleaders!

Jim K.

Jim K · Post by **Jim K** » Wed May 11, 2005 2:41 am

Hey Micke,
You know what? If you look at your picture for 5 minutes, you'll notice there's a Porsche in there too!!! Must be some kind of optical illusion or something!

Jim K.

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Wed May 11, 2005 4:53 am

Wow, you're right! Never would have seen it if you hadn't pointed it out. Amazing...

Seb · Post by **Seb** » Wed May 11, 2005 5:23 am

You mean like a car-Porsche?

Seb

Jim K · Post by **Jim K** » Wed May 11, 2005 6:05 am

Yeah, must be one of those clever IQ tests: spot the hidden car in less than 5 minutes....I lost.

Nice Micke, nice!No wonder you were in for a 20 minute pit-stop!

Jim K.

Micke · Post by **Micke** » Wed May 11, 2005 11:26 am

A what?

None of the TV reporters saw any car there either. That' marketing I say!!

Back to real speculations.....

How much abuse can the gearbox take? Can it cope with 350-400 hp and 350 Nm? A six speed box would be better anyway. Regulations say it has to stay rear mounted. Due to the DeDion design it should be in front of the rear axle making a suitable slightly more difficult to find.

Going above 3.0 makes no sense. The heads flow what they do and the power is virtually the same. Just in higher rpm if the engine is smaller. Question is 2.5 or 3.0. Competition is M3 in both cases. A hybrid with the 2.5 (or even 2.0) short stroke and bored for 3.0 might be ideal.

Next issue.
Does the DeDion and the wheel bearings stand 24 hours (4000 km) of full force with 10-11 inch wide slicks? Front suspension must be totally modified anyway.

Front brakes are only a question of how much to pay. With 17" or 18" wheels they do not need changing in 24 hours.
Inboard rear brakes must probably go out if the car is as fast as desired. The size on the inboad ones is limited to about 270 mm I recall. Outboard brakes have lots of benefits and this is not a problem in a project like this.

Now, everybody would for sure volunteer to drive. AFAIK only Ron from this Alfa group has proven good enough for sub 8's (NS only). I never had a car fast enough so I don't know about myself either. I can tell IT IS NOT AS EASY AS IT SOUNDS.

Maurizio · Post by **Maurizio** » Wed May 11, 2005 12:02 pm

I am no way near a really smooth full out lap, just 25% of the corners is near max.
So if I would be a driver brakes won't be a problem at all for my laps

Ok back to business:
DeDion can easily be strengthened to take the forces. I would be more concerned of mounting point of the dion centre and watt linkage at chassis and axle side.
At the front there is also some serious stiffening needed, when full coil-over and 8" ~ 9"

Backside bearings are strong but 11" slicks would be to much for 4000 km, is a gut feeling, would need more input, can be calculated if there a bearing specs available.

Ok start specs:
Lets say max 20G per wheel, 1000~1100 Kg car, engine rpm max 8000, wil give wheel rpm? etc...

Major problem is driveshaft donuts.....

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Wed May 11, 2005 1:58 pm

Sub 8 minute laps? That is a sick time even if you mean BTG...

Might as well bin this idea right now, that kind of time needs a GT3 and about a summer of training every day.

Barry · Post by **Barry** » Wed May 11, 2005 8:06 pm

what you will realy need is Dirk Schoysmann in a BMW GTR V8.You might stand a chance of doing something then.An old 116 Alfa,std type motor??Forget it guys..But it is good to dream,huh??You would need much more than even the Great Ron Simons`s suspension for the ring as well..Now,where did I put the phone number for the Falken Skyline GTR team??Im sure we could rent the spare ring car from them..................

Jim K · Post by **Jim K** » Wed May 11, 2005 9:29 pm

Yeah, you guys go on figuring out the imaginary bearing loads for the imaginary laptimes of the imaginary car...I got serious shit to deal with here, an imaginary bus load of playmates and no rooms to put'em in! :lol:A manager's job is never done!
One of these days Barry I'll find out just what the hell it is you do at 4 in the morning...one of these days!

Jim K.

Maurizio · Post by **Maurizio** » Wed May 11, 2005 10:48 pm

do you guys never sleep?

Parallel on the dutch forum was this...
http://www.ellegimotori.com/championship.html

In 2004 The Gillet Vertigo motorized with ALFA V6 3.6 engine has opteined the follows results:
New Race Festival -------------> incidente
Nissan World Series -------------> 14° absolute/ 2° cat.
Spa Euro Race -----------------> problema elettrico
24H di SPA --------------------> 13° absolute/ 3° cat. GT2 (3.0 Lt engine)
Bahrain GT Festival-------------> 8° absolute / 2° cat. GT2 (3.0 Lt engine)

Some food for thought, OK stop daydreaming and back to work

http://www.ellegimotori.com/english.html

Ps Micke is\was Dirk not a colleague of you

, never estimate the power of a person realizing his dream!

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Wed May 11, 2005 11:41 pm

Look here:
http://adac.24h-rennen.de/content/result_index.asp

Check out place 13, Alfa Romeo 147 ITD, probably a misspelled JTD? Click the start number link to see laptimes, reliability is the way... Place 42 is definetly a JTD, driven by 'Fred' and 'Barney' Wiiiilmaaaa!

All we need is a couple of spare box/de-Dion/hub asseblies and switch the whole thing, shouldnt take more then five minutes for a prepared crew. Front end is the same, very simple. I really don't dee the wheel bearings being the major problem though, plenty of standard stuff on the 24H I believe.

Sure we can't use Ron's road kit but he would have immense knowledge about what is needed at the ring in a race car, as far as I know he has a very nice GTV6 he drives/race at the ring. You need way softer suspension on the NS compared to your average circuit, that old track in bumpy.
And whoever talked about a 116 engine? Open your mind Barry, open your mind...

BTW, look at the 8th place, that is a Swedish team, took 8th place the first time they entered the race. It can be done.